2k2 UM - General System Changes Thread
- Iie-Kyo
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Hey everyone. Post in here what they did to fix stuff in the 2k2 UM system. You can also talk about general changes to characters (i.e. more characters having OTGs, etc) or you can use this thread as a misc. thread if you don't think making a new thread is worth it.
Some system changes/improvements:
* SDMs can be done outside of MAX mode, but cost 3 stock.
* Same for HSDMs.
* If you DM cancel while in MAX mode it does NOT cost you an extra stock. i.e. there is no reason NOT to end a combo with a DM.
* You fight Omega Rugal if you win against the sub boss before him without using a credit and also scoring more than 300,000 points.
* I'm guessing score determines who you fight as the midboss, but I don't know the specifics.
___ Additional modifications provided by SS:
* Guard meter is now visible
* Changed the speed at which all characters recover their guard meter - Guard meter seems to regain pretty quickly.
* Changed the 'efficiency' of all evasive rolls (range? invincibility duration? he doesn't say) - Rolls seem to be slightly shorter and has less invincible frames
* Changed the 'preparation period' for all jumps (lag before jumping? can't tell) - Indeed, jumps don't start up faster. No more crackspeed hyperhop KoF 2k2 like the original. Jumps are about as slow as 98 speed.
* Improved command recognition down to 1F accuracy - I'm guessing this is relevant to command inputs that require C~A/A~C motions.
* 'Random damage' has been eliminated (is he talking about moves that don't do a fixed amount of damage? Were there any moves like this in 2002 to begin with?) - Moves in KoF always did a random amount of damage, similar to SF2 (tho not as pronounced). It was normally a speck or two, so it's not really noticeable. I only know about this because Ponder was having trouble getting KoF 2k2 to synchronize correctly with GGPO, he mentioned some sort of random number seed was used that caused this which was randomizing the damage you do.
* Window to escape throws is now shorter (this is good for fags like me who abuse tick throws)
* If you press any button other than strong attacks while trying to escape throws your escape will fail - I thought this was always the case?
* Throw damage lowered - Aww.
* Your charge commands will continue to be maintained even if you switch from standing to crouching or vice versa - It didn't?
* Adjusted 'rigor' (block stun?) and activation time for all characters' guard cancel CDs - They probably reduced the CD counter window, or made it so you have to do it at a later point.
* All guard cancel CDs now have higher priority ? - Some characters have shittier CDs - they probably add more invincibility frames to CDs.
* Increased range and speed of guard cancel rolls - Good.
* If you get hit out of your anti-air moves the opponent gets a Counter Hit (was this not the case before?) - The Counter Hit window after you whiff an uppercut is greater. I guess this is to discourage turtling and to encourage more offensive tactics.
* First hit of uppercuts do not push back. This makes them more reliable for using as anti-airs, but also leaves you open more if you whiff it.
* All uppercuts will do the complete number of hits if the opponent is already in midair (i.e. 2 for Kyo and Ryo's + C)
* Hitting someone out of a whiffed command throw nets you a counter hit - They probably left you more vulnerable after a command throw whiffs. This is good.
* MAX duration has been changed to be the same as Kim's from the MVS version of KOF2002 (I wasn't even aware there were character-specific differences) - The animation for the MAX mode activation (pressing BC without canceling anything) is now standard to every character and is the same speed that the one of Kim from the regular 02. <-- I would beg to differ though - Kyo-1 and Kyo-2's max mode animations seem to be pretty fast...
* During MAX mode, while attacking or guarding you can do charge moves without having to charge (not by themselves, I assume to avoid stuff like Heidern projectile spam) - Yeah, this is similar to CvS2's A groove and Vism in SFA3. Charge moves can be done for "free". This is good.
* If you cancel into MAX mode your damage outside of DMs is reduced. Once your combo ends your damage will return to normal MAX mode damage levels. - This is also good, prevents what happened back when Barnessar could cancel into MAX mode for her MAX mode loop.
* Once you use a HSDM you can't use it again for a fixed period of time.
* You can't escape throws that land while you're in the middle of a teleport move or a striking move. - Basically, you can't escape throws if you're recovering from something or if the throw interrupts whatever you're doing. This is good.
*All of the NESTS bosses can crouch and have crouching attacks.
* Characters that had their voices re recorded: K', Maxima, Yuri, Heidern, May Lee, Original Zero, Omega Rugal and I think that Geese and Nightmare Geese as well.
PS2 UM additions:
* Edit Random and Team Random are openly selectable, but you can also press Start to do random old style.
* You can modify the Random options to not pick "new characters" OR boss characters. Great for makeshift tourneys where you want to give players the ability to play Random without risking getting that faggot Igniz or Omega Rugal.
* Team VS CPU mode. I know some KoFs had this and some didn't, but this is useful considering 2k2 UM has no online capabilities.
* RANDOM NOW PICKS EX/ALTERNATE VERSIONS OF CHARACTERS. About damn time - now Random can pick EX Takuma/Robert/Kensou and the Orochi versions of the NFT.
Please add more if you find anything.
Some system changes/improvements:
* SDMs can be done outside of MAX mode, but cost 3 stock.
* Same for HSDMs.
* If you DM cancel while in MAX mode it does NOT cost you an extra stock. i.e. there is no reason NOT to end a combo with a DM.
* You fight Omega Rugal if you win against the sub boss before him without using a credit and also scoring more than 300,000 points.
* I'm guessing score determines who you fight as the midboss, but I don't know the specifics.
___ Additional modifications provided by SS:
* Guard meter is now visible
* Changed the speed at which all characters recover their guard meter - Guard meter seems to regain pretty quickly.
* Changed the 'efficiency' of all evasive rolls (range? invincibility duration? he doesn't say) - Rolls seem to be slightly shorter and has less invincible frames
* Changed the 'preparation period' for all jumps (lag before jumping? can't tell) - Indeed, jumps don't start up faster. No more crackspeed hyperhop KoF 2k2 like the original. Jumps are about as slow as 98 speed.
* Improved command recognition down to 1F accuracy - I'm guessing this is relevant to command inputs that require C~A/A~C motions.
* 'Random damage' has been eliminated (is he talking about moves that don't do a fixed amount of damage? Were there any moves like this in 2002 to begin with?) - Moves in KoF always did a random amount of damage, similar to SF2 (tho not as pronounced). It was normally a speck or two, so it's not really noticeable. I only know about this because Ponder was having trouble getting KoF 2k2 to synchronize correctly with GGPO, he mentioned some sort of random number seed was used that caused this which was randomizing the damage you do.
* Window to escape throws is now shorter (this is good for fags like me who abuse tick throws)
* If you press any button other than strong attacks while trying to escape throws your escape will fail - I thought this was always the case?
* Throw damage lowered - Aww.
* Your charge commands will continue to be maintained even if you switch from standing to crouching or vice versa - It didn't?
* Adjusted 'rigor' (block stun?) and activation time for all characters' guard cancel CDs - They probably reduced the CD counter window, or made it so you have to do it at a later point.
* All guard cancel CDs now have higher priority ? - Some characters have shittier CDs - they probably add more invincibility frames to CDs.
* Increased range and speed of guard cancel rolls - Good.
* If you get hit out of your anti-air moves the opponent gets a Counter Hit (was this not the case before?) - The Counter Hit window after you whiff an uppercut is greater. I guess this is to discourage turtling and to encourage more offensive tactics.
* First hit of uppercuts do not push back. This makes them more reliable for using as anti-airs, but also leaves you open more if you whiff it.
* All uppercuts will do the complete number of hits if the opponent is already in midair (i.e. 2 for Kyo and Ryo's + C)
* Hitting someone out of a whiffed command throw nets you a counter hit - They probably left you more vulnerable after a command throw whiffs. This is good.
* MAX duration has been changed to be the same as Kim's from the MVS version of KOF2002 (I wasn't even aware there were character-specific differences) - The animation for the MAX mode activation (pressing BC without canceling anything) is now standard to every character and is the same speed that the one of Kim from the regular 02. <-- I would beg to differ though - Kyo-1 and Kyo-2's max mode animations seem to be pretty fast...
* During MAX mode, while attacking or guarding you can do charge moves without having to charge (not by themselves, I assume to avoid stuff like Heidern projectile spam) - Yeah, this is similar to CvS2's A groove and Vism in SFA3. Charge moves can be done for "free". This is good.
* If you cancel into MAX mode your damage outside of DMs is reduced. Once your combo ends your damage will return to normal MAX mode damage levels. - This is also good, prevents what happened back when Barnessar could cancel into MAX mode for her MAX mode loop.
* Once you use a HSDM you can't use it again for a fixed period of time.
* You can't escape throws that land while you're in the middle of a teleport move or a striking move. - Basically, you can't escape throws if you're recovering from something or if the throw interrupts whatever you're doing. This is good.
*All of the NESTS bosses can crouch and have crouching attacks.
* Characters that had their voices re recorded: K', Maxima, Yuri, Heidern, May Lee, Original Zero, Omega Rugal and I think that Geese and Nightmare Geese as well.
PS2 UM additions:
* Edit Random and Team Random are openly selectable, but you can also press Start to do random old style.
* You can modify the Random options to not pick "new characters" OR boss characters. Great for makeshift tourneys where you want to give players the ability to play Random without risking getting that faggot Igniz or Omega Rugal.
* Team VS CPU mode. I know some KoFs had this and some didn't, but this is useful considering 2k2 UM has no online capabilities.
* RANDOM NOW PICKS EX/ALTERNATE VERSIONS OF CHARACTERS. About damn time - now Random can pick EX Takuma/Robert/Kensou and the Orochi versions of the NFT.
Please add more if you find anything.
- Toxic Avanger
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Re: 2k2 UM - General System Changes Thread
There are some mistakes on the first post :
All of the NESTS bosses can crouch and have crouching attacks.
Characters that had their voices re recorded :
K', Maxima, Yuri, Heidern, May Lee, Original Zero, Omega Rugal and I think that Geese and Nightmare Geese as well.
The condition is "clearing the game with 1 credit", not one character. It seems that you also need >300.000 points.Iie-Kyo wrote:
Some system changes/improvements:
* You fight Omega Rugal if you win against the sub boss before him without losing a character.
That's correct* I'm guessing score determines who you fight as the midboss, but I don't know the specifics.
Well, to further explain, now the counter window from uppercuts is huge. If you whiff a C Crow bites, for example, when K' falls to the ground and the enemy punish you, they will score counter hit. This is good for those counter wire attacks.* If you get hit out of your anti-air moves the opponent gets a Counter Hit (was this not the case before?) - I think he may mean that the "Counter Hit" point was much narrower. They probably widened this to make anti air abuse less feasible.
"The first hit of the Uppercuts does not push back.* Not sure I understand this one - maybe someone can help me out: 対空技ã®ï¼‘ヒット目をヒットãƒãƒƒã‚¯ã—ãªã„よã†ã«å¤‰æ›´ã€‚
Sounds like the first hit of uppercuts can't be traded with or something? - Dunno?
The animation for the MAX mode activation (pressing BC without canceling anything) is now standard to every character and is the same speed that the one of Kim from the regular 02.* MAX duration has been changed to be the same as Kim's from the MVS version of KOF2002 (I wasn't even aware there were character-specific differences) - They probably made it shorter to make it less abusive.
It's not random, they are fulfilled withing with specific conditions, like winning the match with Nameless MAX2, to see a pic of Isolde.* RANDOM NOW PICKS EX/ALTERNATE VERSIONS OF CHARACTERS. About damn time - now Random can pick EX Takuma/Robert/Kensou and the Orochi versions of the NFT.
All of the NESTS bosses can crouch and have crouching attacks.
Characters that had their voices re recorded :
K', Maxima, Yuri, Heidern, May Lee, Original Zero, Omega Rugal and I think that Geese and Nightmare Geese as well.
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- Higashi Hurricane
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Re: 2k2 UM - General System Changes Thread
Not to mention the fact that you can now Super Cancel into HSDMs.
- Kane317
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Re: 2k2 UM - General System Changes Thread
Not true. You can combo into them, but not Super Cancel. Goro's one isn't really a SC.Tel wrote:Not to mention the fact that you can now Super Cancel into HSDMs.
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- Higashi Hurricane
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Re: 2k2 UM - General System Changes Thread
Aww, rats. That would have been fun.Kane317 wrote:Not true. You can combo into them, but not Super Cancel. Goro's one isn't really a SC.Tel wrote:Not to mention the fact that you can now Super Cancel into HSDMs.
- Iie-Kyo
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Re: 2k2 UM - General System Changes Thread
Thanks for the corrections. I'll implement those. Except this last one I need to talk to you about...
Hmm, not sure we're on the same page here.
In KoF 98 and 2k2 (arcade) if you went with Roulette/Random, it would NEVER roulette to any of the hidden characters. i.e. KoF's 95/RB characters, KoF 2k2's Kusanagi. But in 98 UM and 2k2 UM, if you choose Roulette, it has a chance of picking the EX/Orochi characters into your team. Basically you have access to a bigger variety of characters because of this modification.
Thanks for the other info though, will fill it in.
It's not random, they are fulfilled withing with specific conditions, like winning the match with Nameless MAX2, to see a pic of Isolde.* RANDOM NOW PICKS EX/ALTERNATE VERSIONS OF CHARACTERS. About damn time - now Random can pick EX Takuma/Robert/Kensou and the Orochi versions of the NFT.
Hmm, not sure we're on the same page here.
In KoF 98 and 2k2 (arcade) if you went with Roulette/Random, it would NEVER roulette to any of the hidden characters. i.e. KoF's 95/RB characters, KoF 2k2's Kusanagi. But in 98 UM and 2k2 UM, if you choose Roulette, it has a chance of picking the EX/Orochi characters into your team. Basically you have access to a bigger variety of characters because of this modification.
Thanks for the other info though, will fill it in.
- Toxic Avanger
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Re: 2k2 UM - General System Changes Thread
Blergh, you are right. I completely miss read the sentence.Iie-Kyo wrote:Thanks for the corrections. I'll implement those. Except this last one I need to talk to you about...
Hmm, not sure we're on the same page here.* RANDOM NOW PICKS EX/ALTERNATE VERSIONS OF CHARACTERS. About damn time - now Random can pick EX Takuma/Robert/Kensou and the Orochi versions of the NFT.
One last nod, About roulette picking up every character, that is actually an option within the battle settings menu. The default is "pick every one", but you can configure it to to prevent selecting bosses, or to prevent selecting every hidden character (or was it everyone new to 02UM? I don't remember).
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- Higashi Hurricane
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Re: 2k2 UM - General System Changes Thread
But can you have normal AND EX characters in the same team? You couldn't in 98UM without having the Same Character option turned on. But since the Orochi NFT are now officially divided into two separate teams, I'm wondering if you can have normal and Orochi Yashiro or both versions of Robert together.
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Re: 2k2 UM - General System Changes Thread
Yeah, what you meant was something like this.Toxic Avanger wrote: Blergh, you are right. I completely miss read the sentence.