NGBC tier list

Dream Match never ends!

What do you think of the list?

Great
2
14%
Good
6
43%
Bad
6
43%
 
Total votes: 14

User avatar
Geese
Powering up...61%
Powering up...61%
Posts:148
Joined:Wed Aug 31, 2005 09:48

Post by Geese » Thu Sep 29, 2005 00:25

The tier list isnt too bad so far, but I agree that shermie should be one tier higher and even maybe moriya.

The reason for shermie being, just that she can mix up the attacking pattern so that if you know the opponent likes gcfs'ing, you will still have the advantage, a good example is the shermie in the taiwanese videos

User avatar
Empyrian
Almost there! ...61%
Almost there! ...61%
Posts:406
Joined:Fri May 06, 2005 05:22

Post by Empyrian » Thu Sep 29, 2005 04:34

Robo-Ky wrote:I haven't seen a single decent Geese vid so I'm wondering what Geese can do to deserve being that high on the list... enlighten me.
Geese is someone who is no fun to play against the CPU. This is because he has nothing spectacular, i.e. insane combos for e.g. However his strengths manifest superbly when he is used against humans.

First thing, his normal moves are damaging. He has pretty good moves to shut down the air with his jump attacks, down C and A counter. Light attacks have very good recovery, therefore, a down b*2, reppuken is pretty safe. His command grab is awesome too. He may not have "turn the tide" combos but chances are your opponents are going to get extremely frustrated fighting him.

Super easy to use.

Rating: A/A/B/A.

T.T: The only combos I can do (and find) for Mars people are down A*nth, Qcf E or Df D. He can do a fine run away game but...

Derrick: Off a fwd B, Mai can do a stand C, fwd B, Qcb punch, SC to qcf*2 punch. What else can she do?

Geese: Shermie... I just feel that she isn't "stable" like Blue chips. I can see tons of mismatches for her but if you guys want her to be B, then....
I kinda grade her a C/C/B/C.

I also wanted to rate Moriya A but the thing is, he has big offense but low defense. He has some issues over his mobility too but generally still quite good to use. He could be at A after the next edit. ;p

Perhaps K` and Haohmaru can be moved up the ranks. (Hey, Haohmaru IS easy to use/win in a certain way. ;p)

User avatar
Derrace
Almost there! ...61%
Almost there! ...61%
Posts:407
Joined:Tue Sep 13, 2005 14:10
A.K.A.:Turned ON
XBL:derrace
PSN:derrace

Post by Derrace » Thu Sep 29, 2005 11:43

Empyrian wrote:
Derrick: Off a fwd B, Mai can do a stand C, fwd B, Qcb punch, SC to qcf*2 punch. What else can she do?
Hi again, that combo does quite a hefty bit of damage and is pretty easy to pull off. Her air slam makes up for a lack of anti air. her down air D (pull off at the very last minute) is very fast and tricky. Down A/B, Stand A pokes ain't as good as Mr Big, but it's pretty useful. All I am suggesting is for her to move up one rank.

Not to boost, but I think I can use her pretty well against Marco. Fast C fan prevents from Marco grenading all the time. Jump D air slam beats Marco's Jump A/D.

and considering Marco to be a UBER char...I think it's only fair to move her up one. what u guys think?

cheerios,

ric

~!T.T!~
Almost there! ...9%
Almost there! ...9%
Posts:327
Joined:Sat May 07, 2005 08:52
A.K.A.:Turned ON
Location:Westside, ya0
Contact:

Post by ~!T.T!~ » Fri Sep 30, 2005 02:27

Empyrian wrote:T.T: The only combos I can do (and find) for Mars people are down A*nth, Qcf E or Df D. He can do a fine run away game but...
yeah i suppose he's limited in combos, but runaway/zoning he's not half bad.....i agree with you that he does have crap all in combos, and his supers are all kinda slow (but good for zoning), but i guess when you compare him with asura, he seems a whole lot better
Empyrian wrote: I also wanted to rate Moriya A but the thing is, he has big offense but low defense. He has some issues over his mobility too but generally still quite good to use. He could be at A after the next edit. ;p

Perhaps K` and Haohmaru can be moved up the ranks. (Hey, Haohmaru IS easy to use/win in a certain way. ;p)
yeah, moriya doesn't really have a reliable anti-air, and once you get past his slash-slash-slash gameplay, he's not that hard to get around.....yeah, tier B for sure

if K' wasn't so gcfs'able, i'd definetly put him up a tier.....i guess he could be low B tier if you play him really, really smart

haohmaru should stay in B imo.....other than that slash, fake fireball mixups and big damage, i dont really see anything else that stands out. nakoruru's slash is worse in a way since it can be comboed o_0

User avatar
Empyrian
Almost there! ...61%
Almost there! ...61%
Posts:406
Joined:Fri May 06, 2005 05:22

Post by Empyrian » Fri Sep 30, 2005 03:23

Derrick wrote:Not to boost, but I think I can use her pretty well against Marco. Fast C fan prevents from Marco grenading all the time. Jump D air slam beats Marco's Jump A/D.
I think you are confusing player skill with character strength. This tier is the base level of a character. This is also part of the reason why I put a margin of error to account for player skill/strength.

So Mai's C, fwd B, qcb punch SC to qcf*2 punch takes good damage. The cons are; it is off a heavy attack. (Incidentally, she has no combos starting from low attacks iirc) Second, it takes 2 stocks. I give her a C/B/C/C rating.

Mai's moves also seem pretty easy to GCFS too...

I am actually quite tempted to put Haohmaru up to A. For starters, he is like a A/B/A/A. An excellent zoner with a very damaging down b*2, qcf*2 A combo and etc. He also possess the ability to turn matches within a short time. However, an A ranker should not have too many mismatches which he may suffer when fighting fireballers aka distance fighters and hardcore aggressive characters aka rushdowners. Kinda ironic eh, that he can't fight character types at the extreme ends of both spectra well.

User avatar
Derrace
Almost there! ...61%
Almost there! ...61%
Posts:407
Joined:Tue Sep 13, 2005 14:10
A.K.A.:Turned ON
XBL:derrace
PSN:derrace

Post by Derrace » Sat Oct 01, 2005 07:31

[quote="Empyrian"]
So Mai's C, fwd B, qcb punch SC to qcf*2 punch takes good damage. The cons are; it is off a heavy attack. (Incidentally, she has no combos starting from low attacks iirc) Second, it takes 2 stocks. I give her a C/B/C/C rating.

Mai's moves also seem pretty easy to GCFS too...
[quote]

I believe it's 1 stock.

d B, stand B, df B, DM?

~!T.T!~
Almost there! ...9%
Almost there! ...9%
Posts:327
Joined:Sat May 07, 2005 08:52
A.K.A.:Turned ON
Location:Westside, ya0
Contact:

Post by ~!T.T!~ » Sat Oct 01, 2005 07:59

Derrick wrote:
I believe it's 1 stock.
actually, no, empyrian's right. that super takes 2 stocks, not just 1

User avatar
Empyrian
Almost there! ...61%
Almost there! ...61%
Posts:406
Joined:Fri May 06, 2005 05:22

Post by Empyrian » Sat Oct 01, 2005 13:38

Woe is me. It seems everyone feels (or at least the majority according to the poll) that the list is wrong.

Even people I play with disagree with me.

I wonder how different your lists will be a month from now.

Edit: I am suddenly in awe with Genyjuro. A character of might. Great for v.s. XD

AcidicEnema
ON Elite Spammer
ON Elite Spammer
Posts:544
Joined:Sat Jul 09, 2005 22:10

Post by AcidicEnema » Sat Oct 01, 2005 19:57

the game is still pretty new and is fairly broad in terms of gameplay possibilities.

Nothing stands out yet as being outright Duolon/SvCGeese broken, so yeah, you're gna get disputes for awhile.

P.S., I voted bad just to annoy you and because there wasn't a donut option. :D

~!T.T!~
Almost there! ...9%
Almost there! ...9%
Posts:327
Joined:Sat May 07, 2005 08:52
A.K.A.:Turned ON
Location:Westside, ya0
Contact:

Post by ~!T.T!~ » Mon Oct 03, 2005 15:51

empyrian: i know you said the margin of error was +/- 1, but i'll still put my two cents in:

IMHO kim and robert are borderline top tier due to the fact that robert's pressure especially in the corner can be hard to get out of, and that overhead to combo, omg.....kim however has a very reliable crouching B/overhead/throw/crossup mixup, and that combo off a crouching B just.....hurts coming from a crouching B

k' and shermie imo should be in B tier, maybe even nakoruru......and mars people should be moved up, even if he's bottom of the next tier


also is it just me, or is Big easier to get around now?

User avatar
Empyrian
Almost there! ...61%
Almost there! ...61%
Posts:406
Joined:Fri May 06, 2005 05:22

Post by Empyrian » Fri Oct 07, 2005 11:12

It is a simple matter of amending the list.

Although I don't really agree that they should be higher up. :p

User avatar
Circular
Charging...15%
Charging...15%
Posts:15
Joined:Sun Sep 04, 2005 19:40
A.K.A.:Turned ON
Location:Philadelphia, PA

Post by Circular » Sun Oct 09, 2005 17:26

I thought it might be interesting to compare the tier list posted by Beelzebubble on SRK. I've taken the liberty of ordering his list by tier, since originally the characters were listed in no particular order. I also corrected a couple names. Asterisks denote a character who he didn't have much experience with.

Differences that stick out at me are Marco and Mars People.

TOP

Geese Howard - TOP (insane corner game which is almost impossible to read, big combos in corner with lots of double assault juggles (double assaults early can decide matches), great fb, great normals that close distance from short end of mid, air fb, etc)

Kim Kaphawn - TOP (too fast, long range crossup is too easy, flip kick and speed give him a decent mid-long game, good aa special, super juggles are too good, is one of the best at taking out characters close to death with speed and big combos off lights, good normals, stomp hit on fallen opponents for damage here and there which adds up)

Mr. Big - TOP (g-dly anti air with no startup or input time, combos off c.HK even at its max range, fb game in the corner, 2hit j.C, deceptive long game with dive)

HIGH

Hotaru Futaba - HIGH (big combos juggling with high damage super, options after a slow fb, crazy good crossup, mind games with stances)

Iori Yagami - HIGH (easy combos, command throw set up and fake outs with it work well in this system. gets damage here and there with ground hits on fb, cross up kick, solid dp, etc)

Jin Chonrei - HIGH (super fb that sits in one spot has crazy followup options and its not hard to make sure to have enough meter to be able to use it plenty, great fb, very fast, great dp, great fb+aa game)

Kaede - HIGH (great bnb, awesome damage on super juggle of a c.LK, air fb, good dp, almost no recovery on rekka, good j.D)

Robert Garcia - HIGH (great speed, great fbs with great speed, mixup with overheads, super fb good, air kick good, c.LP combos good, great corner game)

MID-HIGH

Hanzo - MID-HIGH (teleport is too good, good lights, goodish dp, great c.LK->super fb combo especially off a teleport mind game, fastish, air priority on j.LK)

Marco - MID-HIGH (rolling knife mode does crazy damage and is confusing, great games on his grenades which also totally lock down the air, good combos, barf super has great range and damage, crazy mind games with prisoner fb super, technical)

*Mars People - MID-HIGH (g-dly air priority, crazy mixups with supers hitting from behind, above, throwing out eggs, etc, too good c.LIGHTS into double assault, good fb, awkward normals)

*Mizuchi - MID-HIGH (great keepaway game, great juggles, easy to lock down when you get in close)

Moriya - MID-HIGH (great crossup, fast, great bnbs and super juggles,)

Mr. Karate (Ryo Sakazaki) - MID-HIGH (great range of moves and effective at all three ranges but cant get momentum going like robert)

Tung Fu Rue - MID-HIGH (short range is bad, chip damage on lvl 3 super great, quite fast, strong in the air, qcb+B in the air is great for pressure on knock down, button mash move is awesome as aa and for getting chip with level 3 super, decent mid game with specials)

MID

Ai - MID (great mixup/confuse games but very technical)

Akari - MID (technical, good super juggle, decent aa and fb, short range)

*Cyber Woo - MID (technical, autoguard is too good, deceptively fast, good long range game (super and air grab), air grab)

Fuuma - MID (g-dly dp, nice juggles, nice super fb and speed mixup, great j.LK, nice c.LK combos, lacks guard breaking tools/mixup options)

Haohmaru - MID (slow but faster than youd expect, longish recovery on best moves, good combos in this game, dangerous s.C, good c.LK, near useless dp and super)

Genjuro - MID (crazy corner games but plain in every other area/range)

*K' - MID (seems goodish, seems on the other hand to suffer a little in the new system unlike iori who seems almost to benefit from the transplant)

*Kisarah - MID (weird and technical, good super juggle, confusing specials that are hard to read, nice slide kick)

Kyo Kusanagi - MID (no long nor even long end of mid ranges game. corner game nerfed/less effective in this engine)

Mai Shiranui - MID (nice super juggle combo, goodish in close, lots of options from air, no mid or long game to speak of)

Mudman - MID (technical, air knee is too good, long range fb/super fb game is too good, good chains, very average otherwise)

Shermie - MID (faster, nice bnb super combo with lots of time to make sure you dont fuck it up, lots of options in close or all the way up to just inside mid range)

*Shiki - MID (hard to read, fast, crazy specials from long range, nice mix up on meaty combos)

Terry Bogard - MID (suffers against rushdown or jumpers, c.LK->buster wolf, cant combo c.HK into fb, solid normals, good air priority, confusing garou cancels)

Washizuka - MID (great fb, decent fb traps, hard to get a flow with, sluggish reactions)

Yuki - MID (no real mixup, blah normals, harder to combo with)

LOW-MID

*Athena - LOW-MID (lacks options or range, lowish damage)

*Jin Chonshu - LOW-MID (sucky fb, lack of options, doesnt seem as speedy as bro)

*Rock Howard - LOW-MID (good juggles off counters, decent normals but average speed and lack of options hurt him)

LOW

*Asura - LOW (too slow and keepaway game not good enough/weak in NBC system)

*Lee Pai Long - LOW (mid tools but technical)

UNKNOWN

*King Lion - ???? (only fought him once)

*Nakoruru - ???? (seems decent but ive never seen her used and only tried her out once or twice myself)

*Neo Dio - ???? (not seen him used)

User avatar
PenPen
MOAR
Posts:964
Joined:Sun May 08, 2005 08:50
A.K.A.:Manipulating editor
Currently Playing:KOF XIII, Initial D: v6, Football Manager 2011, Dungeon Defenders
PSN:penpen35
Location:The city of lots of pirated stuff!

Post by PenPen » Mon Oct 10, 2005 16:35

In Beezle's tiers I see Kyo at mid-tier. I think that he belongs in the 'high' tier.
Kyo never had a long-mid range game in KOF, he's the close-up pressure type which requires skill and quick responses, the key is to get close and have the opponent open their defenses during pressuring and deal chunks of damage. This incarnation of Kyo is even more powerful than the KOF version since he got a cancellable far C, an air RED Kick, Mu Shiki (with 2k2 MAX mode afterwards to boot), a new subchain of Dokugami, and rather easy crossups with his jump C and d+C.
I do admit that I'm a Kyo fan but I may be a bit biased, but Kyo is strong in this game.

User avatar
Empyrian
Almost there! ...61%
Almost there! ...61%
Posts:406
Joined:Fri May 06, 2005 05:22

Post by Empyrian » Fri Oct 14, 2005 10:32

Circular wrote: posted the tier list by Beelzebubble on SRK for reference.
I just edited my list so whoever else wants to lynch me, please go ahead.

In addition, I must reiterate that my list is derived from both Japanese and Chinese sources. While the sources don't tally 100%, there are clear indications of who is good and who is bad.

User avatar
christensenray
Powering up...70%
Powering up...70%
Posts:150
Joined:Mon Sep 05, 2005 12:31
A.K.A.:Turned ON
Location:Jak 3 - Haven City

Post by christensenray » Fri Oct 14, 2005 11:48

I think CyberWoo should move from A to B just coz he's too damn slow and once under pressure, isnt able to do a whole lot.
Shermie i think should move from C to B because her combos are so easy to do, her ground game rules (being a grappler) and her air game isnt too bad (f+D, dp+K, even jD), thus keeping people on the ground in her domain.
Hanzo doesnt feel right being A, i think coz his attacks arent quite powerful enough, but that's not a v. strong argument, so i wont strongly stress it.
Although i dont use her, AI is VERY dangerous in the right hands (like Derrick's, beats me every time when using AI) and there might be some argument by other people to bump her up.
Other than that, think its a good list.

I think you should re-open or conduct another poll to see what people think of the list.

Post Reply