Best Starter in XI

Empyrian · Post by **Empyrian** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 18:36

As stated above. Who is the best vanguard in XI? XD

Perfect Stranger · Post by **Perfect Stranger** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 18:39

As I was saying to Empy on MSN just now:

I think the main criteria for what makes a good starter is basically "Ability to play effectively without stocks", "Ability to build stock while playing normally", and "Ability to set up an effective QS combo before the opponent can saving shift"

That said, I think Maxima is best. Doesn't really need stocks to do *very* damaging combos, builds stock at a decent rate (not fantastic, but eh), stuns a whole lot and even better, QSes out for full stun combos pretty easily.

Kula comes a close 2nd for me because of top tier bullshite, builds stock at a pretty good rate, QSes ok, but loses points since you need characters who can juggle opponents in the air to capitalise fully on her QS ability.

shura · Post by **shura** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 19:13

Kim uber alles
he really doesn't need stock to be effective, even using him as leader is useless to me
this year kim's version have shitty dms not useful at all his

*2K have no use 'cause you can't do his strong hienzan in middlescreen and the only useful thing after is to do f,fA A and use stock for the dm/ldm

he's a chara that have to stay on the field to spread pain to everyone so if you use him as leader and lose him due to high probabilities surely the judgement won't help you in the end

btw he's a great QS assistant on everywhere and anywhere (crossup, standing, lows) thanks to his qcbP chains so if you have your stocks ready you can switch quicly to land massive damage and keep pressure

and at last he can build a lot of stocks for the others

Empyrian · Post by **Empyrian** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 04:32

Using the same criteria that PS used earlier, I however think that Kyo is the best starter.

While Maxima is really *max* on damage, Kyo's high low game is decidedly much better.

Kula is perhaps the best starter among the S tiers. While Gato is not bad as 1st character and fits all criteria superbly, he eats stocks faster. XD

Malin is also another excellent starter.

Slapper Joe · Post by **Slapper Joe** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 09:10

I think the list is missing two important characters. Ralf and Gai. Ralf laughs at meter and hurts more than anyone without a QS to get you out. His QSs out are gimmicks but still hurt like hell.

Gai's only two negatives when compared to Maxima is he has to work harder/smarter for his damage since there is no 'wonder' d.A and there is no all purpose jump in/cross up. He guard crushes better, deals more damage when he connects, stuns better and is a better QS in or out. He has silly pressure with his d.A/close B into dodge->throw. The down A variant is a particularly nasty tick. Dodge into backfist builds meter nearly as well as Gato's fireball so he is strong enough in that field. Pressure with standing B's works even better when there is no meter to counter you. Can also build more meter/zone with d.D->dodge->roundhouse (like Kim.)

So I'd go for Gai, his only particularly bad matchups with typical opening characters are Duck and Oswald.

~!T.T!~ · Post by **~!T.T!~** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 09:34

i second that. gai seems to go really, really well as a first character due to his momentum and good anti-wakeup games

also, he builds stocks like a bastard too, so that's a plus

Lynko · Post by **Lynko** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:20

I'd go with Kula, she does alot better as a Leader with stock, but if someone else already has that position, you really can't go wrong with her. Moreso since she builds stock decently, and even on a bad day where your skills really just are sucking at the moment, she tends to pull through anyway even if you're messing up.

EDIT: Oh, but Maxima and his yummy autoguard is a close second with me.

Tel · Post by **Tel** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 16:35

I'd go for Kyo as best all-round starter. Decent damage and long chains means you'd be able to get a QS combo ending with a DM relatively quickly compared with many other characters. Although Duck, Jenet, Gato and Oswald are pretty monstrous as starters too IMHO.

AcidicEnema · Post by **AcidicEnema** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 08:50

Vote Maxima.

Gai's biggest advantage, imo, is the number of 1 skill dizzy comboes that he can set up. I don't think it's quite as big as advantage as Maxima's risk-free, random Goro stand D> quick shift bullshit though.

Derrace · Post by **Derrace** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 14:45

My vote goes to Benimaru.

easy to poke, easy to charge stocks, nice crossover for QS. spammable Qcb D esp when opponent does not have a stock to counter/roll.

Nice AA. Good offense. Does not have a natural opponent which can counter his moves.

Empyrian · Post by **Empyrian** » Tue Oct 24, 2006 17:06

Apart from Kula and Maxima being excellent choices for vanguard, Duck is said to be among the best too.

Not surprisingly, as in the beginning of the match, both sides have no stocks.

No stocks = Duck S tier.

And if you are using 2p Duck as well, congrats.. XD

dobiqwolf · Post by **dobiqwolf** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 12:39

I vote for maxima, bc of his stand D he got the advantage over Gai
"I think Maxima is best. Doesn't really need stocks to do *very* damaging combos, builds stock at a decent rate (not fantastic, but eh), stuns a whole lot and even better, QSes out for full stun combos pretty easily. "

Empyrian wrote:Apart from Kula and Maxima being excellent choices for vanguard, Duck is said to be among the best too.

Not surprisingly, as in the beginning of the match, both sides have no stocks.

No stocks = Duck S tier.

And if you are using 2p Duck as well, congrats.. XD

I would like people to explain clearly the advantage of duck as no stock=S tier and about the 2p duck with exemple ect...
thank you all in advance(the answer can and should be post in Duck post so anyone can get acces to it cheers)

:: orochinagi

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