2K2 UM - Lin

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2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Toxic Avanger » Sun Mar 01, 2009 05:38

Basic Movelist :

Command moves :

Benpatsu Ken
fwd .A
Knocks down if done by itself.

Higi Hakkyoku Ken: Dakai
df .C
Quick Overhead, always knocks down.

Special moves :

Kasumi
QCB .P
Small fireball, the A one is really quick, the C one is slow, but gives a huge frame advantage on either block or hit.

Hiten kyaku
HCB .K
Jumping multiple kick. The weak one is fast, knocks down and leaves you open when blocked; the strong one is slightly slower, leaves you safe on block and juggles the enemy, it also has more range and does one more hit compared to the weak one.


Muei Kusashu
DP .C
Zanretsukenesque attack. Before the attack Lin has a guard point where he blocks with his hand.

Tetsuzanbu: Rasetsu
qcf .P
One of his main attacking moves, pretty quick and is very safe. Can be followed up with Nagi.

> Tetsuzanbu: Nagi
HCB .P
Follow up to the qcf + punch, can be super canceled and must be performed with the same button that the initial move

>> Tetsuzanbu: Hakei
fwd .P
Finisher of the qcf .P sequence and must be performed after Nagi, as the previous move, it must be done with the same button that you did the Rasetsu.

Hike Kyaku
HCF .K
Long range teleport, decently quick and offers upper body invincibility.

Jatotsu Ga
RDP + .P or .K
Slightly homing move meant to surprise the enemy. The A version comes really close to Lin, the B version comes at middle range and the C version pops out at almost full screen distance. All of them leave the enemy open for more attacks, but only the C one gives you enough room to apply more complex follow ups. The D version is a feint of the move, and thus doesn't hit at all.


Desperation moves

Hizoku Ougi : Yougou
HCF HCF .K
A walking throw that offers a very big invincibility room, does huge damage and can eat through attacks easily.

Hizoku Ougi : Ranbu Dokuga
QCBHCF .P
Maiden Masher type of ranbu, but with a kick ass attack selection and loud voice acting. Super High priority and has a pretty abusive upper body invincibility, can be performed as MAX,


Hizouku ougi : Senshu Rakan Satsu
dwn dwn dwn .A + .C
Far distance hitting move. Does a lot of damage and is pretty quick, but depending on the distance and if the enemy is crouching or not some of the hits may whiff. Can only be done as MAX.

Hidden desperation moves
Hizoku Ougi : Doku Shukou
HCB HCB .A + .C
Close range throw, does little damage but permanently poisons the enemy and continuously drains their life until they are left with little energy left (for about 5%). If the enemy KOs Lin they don't carry the effect of the poison to the next round (obviously).





His crouching B, crouching C is still good, but needs a closer range than in 00 in order to connect. cr C now works differently, it's easier for the 2 hits to connect.

His close standing D can be canceled.

His B Hiten Kyaku can hit a grounded enemy, one of the best choices to follow up a successful connected strong Kasumi. (Kasumi -> Dash -> Kyaku).

Similar to '00, his Tetsuzanbu super cancels are tricky. For example Qcf + A, Qcb + A into a A button Dokuga (2141236 + punch) is almost impossible to perform. But doing a C button Dokuga in that case made the SC extremely easy. In a similar case, if you are using the C Tetsuzanbu, super cancel them with a A button Dokuga.

His Jatotsu Ga moves (421 + any button) are slower than in 01, and as such you aren't really able to combo them. They work pretty much the same as in 01 netherless, with the C button being the one that juggles the enemy. Since you can't do bread n' butter with these, their usage is pretty hard to grasp and is much more tactical (for example, against a full screen fireball you can use a C Jatotsu to attack the enemy, and then roll the fireball to keep the pressure; assuming that you timed this correctly and the fireball isn't lightning fast).
EDIT -> it seems that he can combo the A and B version of the move, and if the enemy is launched towards you, you can add a crouching C or a close standing A... But that really doesn't change my opinion about the move.

His Yougou (41236 x 2 + kick) was beefed up and now does insane damage. Is still a very good move to "eat" normal standing attacks and throws. This move also walks less than it did in 00.

His Senshu Rakan Satsu (222 + AC) works the same as it did in 2001, that means that to get the maximum amount of hits, you need to be at a certain mid distance range, and have the enemy standing. Pretty much a very powerful and broken move, with huge speed and range.

His Doko Shukou poison move is now his MAX2 and it works fairly similar to 2000. It's a grab that poisons the enemy, however since you are now forced to be on low health to use it, the move is much less useful. I haven't checked if it's properties are 'the same' that in 2000. In 00, every time you hitted the enemy (that means, every time the energy "moves"), you could "speed up" the poison draining process, that meant that some multi hitting moves did insane poison damage. I haven't checked if his good old thick throws tactics from cr B or cls A are still good, but they should be harder to perform due to the slower move sequence that this move has gained (63214 x 2 + AC). A new set up of D Jatotsu ga (421) into this move should, in theory, be a decent thick throw option. I was thinking on also trying this with a blocked Jatotsu that pulls the enemy in, into the poison.

He doesn't seem to have decent doko cancel options, and he isn't really a broken character until you learn how to make the most of his Senshu Rakan Satsu (that's, quick near full screen punishment to almost anything whiffed) and the Tetsuzanbu Supercancel.

edit : Additional info:

Kane317 wrote: I like to do: d.B, d.C, f+A, rdp+C, dp+P


You can actually do a cr C, rdp + D and then Max2 on a blocking enemy, it's tricky to see at first since Lin is not the type of character that has thick throw options.

Dark_Chaotix wrote:1 - in MM, qcf+A, hcb+A, HSDM. You cant normally cancel HSDM so if you do the rekkas just as the bar finishes you can cancel in to HSDM. I couldnt get it to actually link tho........

2 - cB, cB, cA, rekkas. Standard BnB combo

3 - CU jD, cB, cC (1 hit), qcf+A, sA, rekkas. Anyone that has a high arc in their back turn stance can be hit by this. I only know of chris and maybe Chang cos of his size.

4 - cB, cC (1 hit), f+A, qcf+A, hcb+A, SC into hcfx2 B DM. Some may find this hard to do but its actually easier then you think. You dont have to do hcb for the second part of Lin rekka, in fact you can do hcf and it still comes out, thus making your first loop for the DM...

5 - jD, cB, cC, f+A, MM, cB, cC, qcf+A, hcb+A, hcfx2 B DM. Same as above just with a MM combo to begin with.

6 - jD, cB, cC, MM, cB, cC, qcf+A, sA, down x3 AC SDM. Linking the sA into SDM is the tricky part. Doable anywhere.

7 - CU jD, cB, cC, MM, cB, cC, qcf+A, sA, qcf+A, hcb+A, qcb hcf+AC SDM. I could only of gotten this on chris from my trials.The sA into second qcf+A is really tight and you have to be really close so it hits twice.

8 - jD, cB, cC, f+A, MM, cB, cC, qcf+A, hcb+A, hcb+D, dp+A, qcf+A, hcf+B. More of a stylish combo then anything. He doesnt have anything to link after dp+A that works.....MayLee DM would be good but boring??
Last edited by Toxic Avanger on Mon Nov 08, 2010 18:15, edited 6 times in total.

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Kane317 » Wed Mar 04, 2009 09:42

Toxic Avanger wrote: His B Hiten Kyaku can hit a grounded enemy, one of the best choices to follow up a successful connected strong Kasumi. (Kasumi -> Dash -> Kyaku).


I can't get his hcb+B to hit OTG. Are you sure about this? EDIT: Got it to work, the hitbox is strange. Seems like j.CD and the aforementioned combo are the only setups.

Toxic Avanger wrote: Similar to '00, his Tetsuzanbu super cancels are tricky. For example Qcf + A, Qcb + A into a A button Dokuga (2141236 + punch) is almost impossible to perform. But doing a C button Dokuga in that case made the SC extremely easy. In a similar case, if you are using the C Tetsuzanbu, super cancel them with a A button Dokuga.


I see what you're talking about. By itself: qcf+P, hcb+P, sc into Rush DM isn't hard with either button. It gets much trickier if you add s.C, F+A, before the sequence. In general, the hcb+P part can't be buffered too early (especially with the f+A), so you can't really start the SC...plus the hcb+P frame itself comes out real fast. Once you get the timing it isn't too bad.

While we're on the topic, if you watch the maniac combo on the ultimate combo DVD, you'll see Lin ends the combo with: ...<MaxMode> qcf+P, hcb+P, MC into hcb+D, dp+P, SC into qcb~HCF+AC SDM. I can't seem to catch the opponent after the SC, it just keeps missing the falling opponent. Any tips?

Toxic Avanger wrote: His Jatotsu Ga moves (421 + any button) are slower than in 01, and as such you aren't really able to combo them. They work pretty much the same as in 01 netherless, with the C button being the one that juggles the enemy. Since you can't do bread n' butter with these, their usage is pretty hard to grasp and is much more tactical (for example, against a full screen fireball you can use a C Jatotsu to attack the enemy, and then roll the fireball to keep the pressure; assuming that you timed this correctly and the fireball isn't lightning fast).
EDIT -> it seems that he can combo the A and B version of the move, and if the enemy is launched towards you, you can add a crouching C or a close standing A... But that really doesn't change my opinion about the move.


I like to do: d.B, d.C, f+A, rdp+C, dp+P Sometimes the f+A will knock the opponent into the air and the rdp will miss.

-Sadly, d.Bx2, d.A, qcf+A, hcb+A, f+A does less damage than: s.C, f+A, qcb+A

-If for some reason you're doing the qcf+A, hcb+A (has to be A) without a s.C or anything before it, then SC into hcfx2+K DM does more damage than the Rush DM.

-Here's a tricky setup: s.C, f+A, rdp+B, d.C -->hcf+B teleport in which you can either a) d.B combo b)df+C

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Toxic Avanger » Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:27

Kane317 wrote:While we're on the topic, if you watch the maniac combo on the ultimate combo DVD, you'll see Lin ends the combo with: ...<MaxMode> qcf+P, hcb+P, MC into hcb+D, dp+P, SC into qcb~HCF+AC SDM. I can't seem to catch the opponent after the SC, it just keeps missing the falling opponent. Any tips?


I haven't studied much, but for the looks of it, it only works on certain characters. For example I tried this on may lee and got it easily every time. Against Nameless I always whiffed. I knew of that combo before, but due to this I didn't thought about posting it. For the record, try to always use the MAX version of the ranbu, since it's faster.

I like to do: d.B, d.C, f+A, rdp+C, dp+P Sometimes the f+A will knock the opponent into the air and the rdp will miss.


If the fwd + A is knocking the enemy down, that's because you are delaying it. Train yourself to input it as early as possible and it will never knock down. I usually do cr C, fwd x 2 + A, that pretty much voids the possibility of getting an accidental Qcf. But canceling the move after a fwd x 2 can be tricky if you don't have a clear head at the time, or haven't trained yourself.


-Sadly, d.Bx2, d.A, qcf+A, hcb+A, f+A does less damage than: s.C, f+A, qcb+A


cr B combos aren't used for their damage, but rather for their speed, for example is a pretty good "roll punishment" combo, or when using the good old cr B -> run cr B / short jump B.

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Tel » Wed Mar 04, 2009 11:36

Too bad they changed his HSDM command. I loved being able to cr.B > cr.A > d+AC back in 2k.

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Kane317 » Thu Mar 05, 2009 11:56

Toxic Avanger wrote: I haven't studied much, but for the looks of it, it only works on certain characters. For example I tried this on may lee and got it easily every time. Against Nameless I always whiffed. I knew of that combo before, but due to this I didn't thought about posting it. For the record, try to always use the MAX version of the ranbu, since it's faster.

Damn, it's one of those character sensitive combos? Shame, it's something he really needed too.
Toxic Avanger wrote:If the fwd + A is knocking the enemy down, that's because you are delaying it. Train yourself to input it as early as possible and it will never knock down. I usually do cr C, fwd x 2 + A, that pretty much voids the possibility of getting an accidental Qcf. But canceling the move after a fwd x 2 can be tricky if you don't have a clear head at the time, or haven't trained yourself.

Oh, I figured it was kinda like Takuma's f+A ('98UM among other versions). Strangely, I never get the qcf+P overlap coz I train myself for all c.A/C into f+A/B to do it the Zaineken motion (d.B, f+P) instead, viola, no overlap.
Toxic Avanger wrote: cr B combos aren't used for their damage, but rather for their speed, for example is a pretty good "roll punishment" combo, or when using the good old cr B -> run cr B / short jump B.

I miss his counter mode d.B x n combo now :)

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Dark_Chaotix » Thu Oct 14, 2010 14:01

Maybe abit late but oh well



Transcript

MM = maxmode
CU = cross up

1 - in MM, qcf+A, hcb+A, HSDM. You cant normally cancel HSDM so if you do the rekkas just as the bar finishes you can cancel in to HSDM. I couldnt get it to actually link tho........

2 - cB, cB, cA, rekkas. Standard BnB combo

3 - CU jD, cB, cC (1 hit), qcf+A, sA, rekkas. Anyone that has a high arc in their back turn stance can be hit by this. I only know of chris and maybe Chang cos of his size.

4 - cB, cC (1 hit), f+A, qcf+A, hcb+A, SC into hcfx2 B DM. Some may find this hard to do but its actually easier then you think. You dont have to do hcb for the second part of Lin rekka, in fact you can do hcf and it still comes out, thus making your first loop for the DM...

5 - jD, cB, cC, f+A, MM, cB, cC, qcf+A, hcb+A, hcfx2 B DM. Same as above just with a MM combo to begin with.

6 - jD, cB, cC, MM, cB, cC, qcf+A, sA, down x3 AC SDM. Linking the sA into SDM is the tricky part. Doable anywhere.

7 - CU jD, cB, cC, MM, cB, cC, qcf+A, sA, qcf+A, hcb+A, qcb hcf+AC SDM. I could only of gotten this on chris from my trials.The sA into second qcf+A is really tight and you have to be really close so it hits twice.

8 - jD, cB, cC, f+A, MM, cB, cC, qcf+A, hcb+A, hcb+D, dp+A, qcf+A, hcf+B. More of a stylish combo then anything. He doesnt have anything to link after dp+A that works.....MayLee DM would be good but boring??

Anyways hope you enjoy it and get something out of it.

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Gunsmith » Thu Oct 14, 2010 17:41

Thx however

a) Turn your sound input down - there seems to be a fuzz to it
b) defrag your hard drive or capture at a smaller resoultion because the video is choppy
c) Disclaimer is too long. It should last one second max after the scrolling of the text has finished
d) I hate Lin

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Toxic Avanger » Thu Oct 14, 2010 20:29

There is a small bug that can help you extend certain combos.

For example, perform the exact same combo as the last one, but after the juggling kick you can do a df .C , then approach the enemy as close as possible and perform his rambu DM (or SDM) when they are standing up. If you time it properly it will hit the enemy from behind and there is simply no escape to it, because it hits them in a frame of the standing up animation where you can't input anything but block (and the block doesn't even activate since you are hitting them "from behind"). The bug also can be performed if they roll recover; but the timing is different, that's why the easiest way is to force the knock down.

You might have seen this bug made by some Angel players (since she also has a no start up ranbu and it's petty easy to achieve "the bug conditions" with her), but Lin had this bug first since the original '00. This doesn't work in some characters because they are "too slim" and because of that you can't catch them from behind on that frame where they can't block (Against Nameless I know you can't achieve this, I don't know by memory the list of the characters that aren't vulnerable to the bug, they aren't that many anyway).

Gunsmith wrote:d) I hate Lin


Out of this thread, you philistine!
Last edited by Toxic Avanger on Fri Oct 15, 2010 14:54, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Dark_Chaotix » Fri Oct 15, 2010 06:47

Love you too gun haha :D

Its not my capture card, its my editing software as it is temperamental at times. I set the sound to low but still come out loud and the frame rate is at the right fps....not sure why it drops frames.

Hmm i didnt know about the df+C ill have to investigate it. If i get more ill make a part 2.

Not sure which other characters to tackle....but Lin is the shit Gun! Get with it yo!

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Gunsmith » Fri Oct 15, 2010 08:03

Did you set your line in volume on windows to low as well?
Defrag that drive!
Do any character - if xiii is crap, I'll be joining you with video guides
Lin = HAGE

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Dark_Chaotix » Sat Oct 16, 2010 06:36

I couldnt really find anything new even with the df+C knockdown option. Ive watched Lin players in 2k2um alot and ive yet to see anything come out of df+C thats a positive. Then again, most dont MM with Lin to begin with....

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Re: 2K2 UM - Lin

Post by Dark_Chaotix » Wed Nov 03, 2010 22:09

Good Lin "hit and run" style gameplay. Very effective if you are patient and not combo happy.



Round the 5:50 mark.

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